Come Celebrate the First Virtual May Day

Steve Dondley's picture

Trade unionists from around the globe will be descending on Union Island today to celebrate the May Day. If you want to attend, don't bother leaving your house, the gathering is coming to you via Second Life, software that lets you navigate a three dimensional, virtual world using a digital representation of yourself. Read on to learn more.

If you haven't heard or are reluctant to try Second Life, this is a great opportunity to test it out. It's quite amazing software. It's free to use and you'll have plenty of friendly unionists to help you figure out how to explore the digital universe that is Second Life. The gathering is being put together by forward thinking trade unionists sponsored and supported by some of Europe's largest union federations.

Ready to join me today? Best place to start is here and download the PDF which will help you get started.

local370voice's picture

Second Life

What a great software. It was fairly easy to use after a bit of practice. You need a good graphics card. It was a great experience. Virtual displays on some very important labor movements and events. Many people were there from around the world who truly cared about labor. Of course we also had the vendors who came not to join hands with labor but to sell their wares.You could set up your own scheduled event. Our own Steve Dondley had one. Not to discuss the plight of the working men and woman. Not to join hands with the Nigerian Transportation worker. Steves event was all about hawking Drupal.How important using Drupal is in building Union web sites. And how his company Prometheus Labor can build you one with Drupal. There were Nigerian Transportation workers and South American Transportation workers moved to tears.Now I have just sent Drupal and Acquia a letter. I asked them how many of their employees are in a Union and which one. I asked how many of their investors employees are in Unions. I asked how Acquia has supported Labor Unions in any way. If they say NONE I have to ask why we should be Hawking Drupal as not a good blog builder but as "The Future of Labor On the Web" Always the dollar before the worker. Wait now isnt that a management position. No wait thats the teamsters.

One interesting investor for the new Acquia Inc is North Bridge Venture Partners who gave 10 Million dollars to Healthcare Analytics, a Waltham, Mass., health-technology firm. This 10 million is helping to create a patient-only credit check. Thats right credit check for the sick . Now we want to make sure you can afford to get treated or not with Health Care Analyitcs Credit check for the ill. Financed by North Bridge the same people that bring you Drupal the future of web Labor.Its much like your credit score. Risk you get an intern. Not prime a Doctor Hack. Prime fair care. 900 credit score and you get Dr. Kildare . Now there is some integrity for you

Steve Dondley's picture

1) I was invited to speak at

1) I was invited to speak at the May Day event. I did not place myself on the schedule. Even if I did create the time myself, I wouldn't have any reason to hide that. At any rate, the presentation did not cover my services. It focused on Drupal and why it's an ideal candidate as a software platform for unions. No one wants to go there to hear a sales pitch.

2) You are free to knock Drupal as much as you please. I happen to think it's a great platform. I've been using it for 5 years and it's served my clients well.

3) I build websites for a living for unions. That's how I make money. I am not ashamed by that. I'm proud of it and I love doing it.

4) Why would I talk about the plight of Nigerian workers or any other topic I know nothing about? I'm an expert at building websites for unions with Drupal. That's what I know best. I help unions communicate on the web. It's no different than having a workers' comp attorney talking about workers' comp insurance.

5) Acquia did not "bring us" Drupal. Drupal has been around since 2001. Acquia was formed about 3 or 4 months ago. They are one of hundreds of companies that provides services using Drupal as a platform. Drupal is owned by the community. That includes you. You are free to contribute to the project. Anyone is. It's owned, essentially, by no one.

Steve Dondley's picture

Forgot one

6) Drupal doesn't have employees. It's all volunteer.

johninnit's picture

Unions in Second Life

Sorry local370voice, but you've got totally the wrong end of the stick on this one. We (Union Island Project admins including myself) asked Steve to come present specifically about his experience of Drupal, as we wanted to use his considerable talents to see how well the Second Life system would work for specialist learning events (very well as it happened, with a good number of people coming to the island specifically for this session).

We're hoping also to use other people from other areas of the labour movement and our allies, such as for example unionised professors who want to use the platform to give lectures. Upcoming next week is a book launch for a commercial Sci-fi book, but it's one which is also part of a union backed adult-literacy programme to help more UK workers develop basic skills they need. So we're planning a wide range of functions and angles for the platform, as well as more conventional organising events.

I'm not 100% so sold on Drupal as Steve (more like 90%), but I do recognise it's a hugely powerful and pretty simple tool for sites which need more community management power than you can manage with a simpler system like my favourite, Wordpress, which is why we wanted more union activists to hear about it so they could use it to run their own sites at zero cost with volunteer-written software. As Steve says, don't confuse it with a commercial web site system, or a conventional company - the group behind it are an open and activist-run non-profit, and the results of their work are free to anyone who wants to make use of them. I've built four labour sites in Drupal now, and as it's open source non-commercial software, it means we can do much much more ourselves with a very low budget than we could do relying on external agencies, whether unionised or not (though incidentally the only unionised IT development agencies I've come across so far are Steve's outfit and the people who helped us build the island).

Glad you liked the island and hope to see you there again! Let us know what else you think it should be doing: www.slunionisland.org

local370voice's picture

Wrong End

“I build websites for a living for unions. That's how I make money. I am not ashamed by that. I'm proud of it and I love doing it."

First may I say thank you for Union Island and Second Life. It is a great concept and I enjoyed it very much. I have not responded to Mr. Dondley because the above statement settles my differences with Mr.Dondley. Also I did not do so because he should know I do not need a history lesson on who and what drupal is. I am quite aware who created Drupal,what it is and how it is a very nice tool for the type of sites Steve prefers. I to prefer Wordpress but not being in the same class as Mr Dondley in web building proficiency I don’t put much stock in my opinion on web design. I feel with my limited knowledge that Drupal is a great tool. My issue is with the way Mr. Dondley is marketing it and himself. He is not hawking it, as I like to call it, as a great web building tool but he is attempting to add a marketing ploy that gives Drupal a “Spirit of Unionism” connotation. His site “Union Proud for Drupal” is an example of his marketing ploy.. Since Mr. Dondley wants to market Drupal to further his business by having us believe “Labor should support Drupal” and not "web sellers should support Drupal” then I must ask what have the creators of Drupal done for labor. What has the Drupal Association done for labor? What has Acquia done for labor? Let us ask what Union Dries Buytaert is in or was in when he offered Drupal to the world. Although Drupal itself is not a commercial venture the Drupal Association has sold memberships to many and the newly created Acquia is indeed a Commercial venture involving Dries Buytaert. You cannot ignore the connection between the two. The businees world does not.Would you also have us believe the Board of Directors of the Drupal Association is not compensated like any other board on a non profit.Mr Dondley presents himself in the same way. Instead of presenting himself, as he admitted above, as a web builder out to make money by selling web site to Unions he would have us believe he is a friend and supporter of organized labor. Perhaps he feels that this manner he is furthering the Union cause. I feel that by ignoring the Rank and File and pandering to the Union hierarchies he supports only his business.

While I find Mr Dondley to be a talented person judge solely from our online contact and by seeing his work I must say he is not a supporter of Unionism but a person aggressively promoting his web building business to his target market which are Unions. Mr Dondley does not support the core of what is Unionism and that as you are aware is the Rank and File worker. Any support he does offer to Unions is to the Union hierarchy whom he supports as he courts their business. The only two sites Prometheus Labor Mr Dondely has provided to a rank and file worker are Union review and UBC Newsroom. Both grew in to nothing more than propaganda sites that scour the internet stealing the work of others and posting it to their sites. The owner of Union Review is now an employee of the Teamsters where he is building and maintaining web sites that Censor their members and restrict content from the members. You will find the discussion of this in another place on this site .Before Dondley built Union Review for Negri he expressed concerns that the Unions he panders to for business would be upset about a rank and file web site that could possibly be critical of Union Officials and jeopardize his ability to sell them web sites .Judging by Negris refusal to allow any Union Official to be challenged such as Ron Taylor and PATCO it seems they have reached a compromise. It confirms my only issue with Mr. Dondley and that is his first priority is a buck. He insults the Rank and file worker by insisting we are not intelligent or civilized enough to be trusted discussing Union Business and he by his own admission wants to keep “Dirty Laundry” behind closed doors so that Union Officials can control their possible illegal actions and continue to do “Business as Usual” .Engaging in ,supporting and agreeing to policys that supress the Rank and File is NOT in any way a support to the workers.

In regards to Drupal. Yes it is an open source tool that is furthered by contributions of the community. But to say it is not a commercial venture one has to wonder. Businessweek seems to disagree. In regards to Buytaert “Seven years on, as he tries to turn his idea into a successful business” “Buytaert is among a handful of innovators who are building businesses and products aimed at other companies”” Buytaert will try to make money through sales of related support services.” While the concept of Drupal continues as a “a project that draws together software developers from around the world who collectively tinker with and add features to the content management system made available for free” the movement is now to promote Drupal for the purpose of making a dollar. The good thing about this is that in its quest to make Drupal payoff Acquia will make Drupal a better product. But a product it is and it is generating Millions for those who have made it a “Commercial Venture. Mr. Dondleys marketing niche is Organized Labor. We in Unions should flock to Drupal and support this “Future of Labor Communications” Which by the way is a catchy slogan but hardly the truth. So as a Union member I must ask that if Union members money is to be funneled towards companies that are out to make a profit from the use of Drupal then I must ask why should we, What has Drupal done for Labor. We all like to use the catch phrases “Buy Union” and “Look for the Union Label”. I see that this does not apply to software and tools such as Drupal. Do we not as Union members have a duty to not only buy the Union made t-shirt but the Union made programs similar to Drupal. Before we support Drupal so those that are “Experts” in its use can make money off labor should we not look for the Union Label. If they are not out there than should Labor endeavor to lend support to startups that are in Labor. You say Drupal has no employees. Well Acquia most certainly does. Their investors most certainly do. The Drupal Association certainly does. Prometheus Labor certainly does. Did you ask which Union Mr Dondleys employees are in when you invited him.So are we in Labor involved in a movement to organize these companies? Should we not scrutinize all their associations to see if they are Labor Friendly? Should we support a “Tool” who has investors that financially support credit checking the ill? Did Mr. Dondley finish his presentation at Union Island discussing how Labor should organize this booming industry? Or should we restrict ourselves to trying to sign Mexican truckers as they cross US borders while at the same time condemning them as the scourge of the earth as did the Teamsters.

I took your enticement to go to Union Island on May Day to join other Union members from around the world in solidarity. To view presentations on Labor and learn about the struggles of my fellow Union working men and women.. Mr. Dondley stated “Trade unionists from around the globe will be descending on Union Island today to celebrate the May Day.” But Mr. Dondley was not going there to stand with Union Brothers but to Hawk Drupal and regardless of his soliciting business for Prometheus Labor it just so happens his company can build you a web site using Drupal. My only mistake was not knowing you invited Mr.Dondley . I wrongly assumed Mr. Dondley took the opportunity to promote himself and his business with the intent to sell more web sites. I apologize for not knowing you invited him. Maybe if Mr. Dondley had instead said. Join me at Union Island as I promote Drupal one would not have gotten the WRONG impression that Mr. Dondley was going in to stand with Union members from around the world. “Why would I talk about the plight of Nigerian workers or any other topic I know nothing about? I'm an expert at building websites for unions with Drupal.” I know nothing about the plights of these workers around the world but is that not what we went to Union island on May Day for. I did. Did Mr. Dondley offer at any time during his trip to Union Island offer any web services to any Union Group or organization for free in solidarity and support of their causes? Did he commit Prometheus Labor and his Drupal expertise to any group for free so that it might further lift their struggle?

There is nothing wrong with being a business man. Mr. Dondley is very good with Drupal. His sites are excellent. Well done and I wish him well in his quest to make money. I do have issue with Mr. Dondley marketing Prometheus Labor and Drupal as the future of Labor Communications when in truth the only support he gives to labor comes with a price tag. In his defense Prometheus gave away 25 sites to Unions. Did he do so to support Labor or to market Prometheus. As he said “I build websites for a living for unions. That's how I make money” That is all I have ever wanted Mr.Dondley to admit. Next we need to work on getting the self proclaimed “Labor Messiah” Richard Negri to admit Union review is nothing more than a pro Union Propaganda site. The self proclaimed friend and future of labor on the net supports member censorship and control and actively works with the Teamsters to censor its members and spread Teamster Propaganda. I find it an insult to the Rank and File that this farce continues. The fact that Teamster Power has admitted it is a Propaganda site in posts here on CoD gives us an insight to Negris policies and intentions. It is rather insulting for him to promote the Union member on one site and work for the Teamsters in censoring its membership and spreading Propaganda on others. That is what’s called Unionism to the highest bidder. Solidarity for a buck.

Steve Dondley's picture

Well, those who really know

Well, those who really know me know that I am a big supporter of labor unions and the fight for justice for workers. You are free and entitled to make your own judgments. I guess it's in the eye of the beholder.

You might be interested to know that my name in Second Life is "Prometheus Hawker," with tongue in cheek. So I make no bones about the need to market my product. I try to find a balance between shameless plugs and good information.

I've done a huge amount of work for free over the years and at steeply discounted rates. I do rank and file sites: See http://railroadworkersunited.org. I've done tons of work at no cost or steeply discounted my work for organizations that are strapped for cash, probably well into the tens of thousands of dollars. Have a look at the http://neworleanslabormedia.org site. I paid money out of my own pocket to make that site happen.

Anyway, I'm not going to go on with you to defend my character. You can continue to impugn my character if you wish. I'm not sure what good you think will come of it. My experience with you is that you seem to make it your mission to seek out and find the worst aspects of people, real or imagined. That's your choice, of course. But my advice is that if you begin focusing on the good within people more, you'd help whatever cause you have a lot more. Because unions, after all, are all about working together and cooperation.

Brotherly Love,
Steve

local370voice's picture

Good and Bad

Actually Steve I seek out the truth in people good or bad.
One thing you can say about me like it or not I am not a phony.I speak my mind like it or not. I am not seeking out anything that is not there. If you have done all this free work than I stand corrected and I hope you continue to do so.

Steve Dondley's picture

"I am not seeking out

"I am not seeking out anything that is not there". I think that what you have written here demonstrates otherwise.

You seem to have an image of me as a greedy, self-centered business man who's out just to make a buck. As you've shown above, you're prone to come up with "facts" to help support that perception of me (like the bit about me putting myself on the schedule).

You're a carpenter and have to charge for you labor. I don't think you are ashamed of that so why should I be? I provide a product and service and charge money for it. But maybe somehow you think I'm trying to hide that. But how would you ever arrive at that impression? Do you see the big ad on the left? Did you read my profile on this site? I have nothing to hide or cover up. I'm Steve Dondley, owner of Prometheus Labor Communications, and I sell websites to unions for a living.

I have a family and a mortgage and things I'd like to do and see before I die with what money I have left over. But I'm in this line of work because I enjoy doing it and it's in line with my politics.

Anyway, this is the last I'll post about this and try to justify myself to you. I've got tons of work I need to be doing.

local370voice's picture

???

"Prometheus Hawker," Are you sure. I was in last night and I must have saw your cousin "Steve Hawker"

Steve Dondley's picture

There is a limited universe

There is a limited universe of last names in SL (maybe a coupld hundred). My SL name is indeed "Prometheus Hawker."

Steve Dondley's picture

By the way, before making baseless accusations...

Please consider trying to ask someone to get more information.

local370voice's picture

Which one was baseless

You would want to share that would you not??

Steve Dondley's picture

I can't spend the time

I can't spend the time picking them all out. But here are the larger ones off the top of my head:

That I put myself on the schedule of the SL May Day event.
That I don't do volunteer work.
That I don't do websites for rank and file organizations.

local370voice's picture

Schedule

You are right. I was wrong on that. It is "so" important how you got there instead of why you were there. I especially liked you comment about "sales pitch" What I really liked is how you were listed for the event. It was not listed as a discussion on Drupal by Steve Dondley . The event was by "Prometheus Labor Communications" Dant Dant da(Roman Trumpets) .No shameless plug or sales pitch there. Thank god or people might not have came.

Steve Dondley's picture

You'll have to speak with

You'll have to speak with John Wood (the same gentleman who commented above) about how I was listed. That's how he chose to list me. I didn't have any input on that. Not that I mind the good publicity anyway.

local370voice's picture

Asking

For more information. What Union are you or any of your workers in at this time. I mean your are in a Union right.

Steve Dondley's picture

I am a member of OPEIU Local

I am a member of OPEIU Local 6, Boston, MA. I have no employees (too small to have one at this time). Bill Bumpus is my main independent contractor who is a died in the wool socialist and member of the IWW and committed to the labor movement. He's been building websites for unions longer than I have. Any other contractors (like programmers) I might use on a more than casual basis are required to pay dues to a union. These contractors are freelancers and I negotiate rates with them directly.

local370voice's picture

Thanks for the Info

Well thats a plus. Since you were out of Local 1459 I had wondered if you would be so bold as to be non Union and sell to Unions. It threw me off when you posted your ad for a new employee on the net. "Full-time Drupal Project Manager/Developer to Build Union Websites".So OPEIU cannot fill that and is Prometheus Labor signed with OPEIU? How about Danaus. Will they be paying dues. What Union are they associated with.

By the way. Forget about the I dont like you and you dont like me for a minute. How about commenting on the issue of what Drupal has done for labor and Acquias Union membership. I mean since future improvements to Drupal that is not from the community will be coming from Acquias
and their paid employees. Should they not be Union if Drupal is to be the "Future of Labor Communications" By the way.It took me about 30 minutes to learn WordPress and a few days to play with installing widgets and learning the quirks of their theme editor so I guess I am a WordPress expert. I have declared that WordPress is the "Future of Animal Husbandry" on the Internet. Now if only the sheep will go for it.What do you think

Steve Dondley's picture

About Danuas

Danaus is owned by a law student, Morris Singer, he launched that company as an LLC right around the time I started Prometheus (2006) when he was fresh out of college.

Morris is a great guy heavily involved in Democratic politics. I met him while working on the campaign of Peter Vickery, a local progressive politician/attorney here in Western Massachusetts. Morris was also the town selectman for the town of Amherst at the age of 20. He led the campaign to bring voting booths to the UMass campus. Very smart, capable mature dude. He didn't know a lick of PHP or anything about Drupal but I was able to train him and he was a great asset to Prometheus. He's going to be working for me again over the summer part-time.

He paid dues to OPEIU Local 6 when he did work for me. He is now at Suffolk University in Boston getting his law degree.

local370voice's picture

But

Is Danuas, and now I have to ask, or Prometheus labor a signatory with a Union which unless I am wrong makes a company Union or non Union. I am sure Danuas has more than Morris as an employee judging by the work they have listed on their site. Do his employees pay Union dues. Lets make this easy. Are you a non union company subcontracting to a non union company. I am trying not to insult you by playing cat and mouse but this is what I am interested in and you said to ask

Steve Dondley's picture

No. We, as individual owners

No. We, as individual owners of companies, pay dues to a union. This isn't like the building trades with signatories. Morris is the owner and only worker. He has no employees, I can assure you.

I am a man in charge of my own labor who negotiates a fair price with other men or women in charge of their own labor for their services. I pay dues to a union and I require those people to be dues paying members of unions when they do work for me (at least those I use more than casually).

Steve Dondley's picture

For someone such as yourself

For someone such as yourself who appears to be a real stickler about which technology services are union or not, it strikes me as odd that you pay to have your website, therankandfilenews.com, hosted with a non-union outfit like Host Monster. I confirmed this by asking a sales representative on their live chat feature. Notice how I didn't make a blind assumption about their union status. Instead I did a quick investigation and confirmed my initial suspicion. Here is the transcript:

Korban [6:14:47 AM]: Welcome to our real-time support chat. How can I help you today?
Steve Dondley [6:14:47 AM]: Are your workers represented by a union?
Korban [6:14:58 AM]: Sorry no? How can I help you?
Steve Dondley [6:15:21 AM]: I'm just wondering if your workers are represented by a union? I'm looking for a union hosting outfit.
Korban [6:15:59 AM]: Sorry we are in the state of Utah. A non union state
Steve Dondley [6:16:10 AM]: ok, Thanks.

Now, if I were so inclined, I could make all kinds of nasty assumptions about you and your character and go on about you being a supreme hypocrite. But I'm not going to do that. I'm going to assume that this is an oversight on your part. Call me naive, but I try not to assume the worst in people. If you say you are sincere, I am going to assume you are sincere until you prove otherwise. Instead of taking glee in attacking you and trying to throw egg all over your face, I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt that you either did not realize or did not stop to think that there are unionized companies out there that could host your WordPress site.

So please allow me to direct your attention to Google where you can do a search on "union website hosting" and find some competitors of mine. You'll find quite a few companies there. You should probably call them and confirm their status as a union shop and that they meet your criteria as a union-friendly company before moving your site over.

Steve Dondley's picture

About OPEIU

OPEIU is not a hiring hall. They are a professional union for white collar workers. They have a lot of state workers. I joined OPEIU after leaving my paid position at the Pioneer Valley AFL-CIO (I still serve as the Recording Secretary) because that was the same union the staff at the Mass AFL-CIO had.

Steve Dondley's picture

About Drupal vs. Wordpress

It's funny, at our local Drupal meeting last night, I ran into a guy at Argaric Designs named Dan. He used to build websites with Wordpress until he "outgrew" it. He would be better qualified than I as to tell you the advantages of Drupal over Wordpress.

There are lots of debates and opinions out there as to why Drupal is or isn't the greatest thing since sliced bread. I happen to think it is for several reasons. Please refer to http://drupalforlabor.org, a site I am constructing to help inform unions about the advantages of Drupal software.

Like I said, it's served my clients very well to date and the software continues to get better as it matures.

Steve Dondley's picture

About Acquia

As I've tried to explain, Acquia is just one of hundreds, perhaps thousands, of companies that provide services around Drupal and contribute to the Drupal project. Drupal is kind of like the air we breathe. Everyone has a right to it and the practical reality is that no one owns it. It is open source/free software under the GPL, just like WordPress is.

I'm sure there are unethical companies that use and contribute to WordPress (not that I agree with you that Acquia is unetchical and I'm not interested in debating you about them because I really know very little about them), but that shouldn't stop you from using it. That would be akin to refusing to enter any rooms with unethical people out of fear that you might share the same air molecules as them, which, of course, would be a silly and impractical policy to adopt.

So your assertion that Acquia somehow taints Drupal conveys a fundamental lack of understanding about the nature of the Drupal project and free software in general. To help you get a clearer understanding, I refer you to the philosophy of free software and how it works here: http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/philosophy.html. Excellent reading. Enjoy. You might also want to visit the Free Software Foundation, http://www.fsf.org/, an organization which I am a member of. If you enjoy and use free software like WordPress, you may want to consider joining the Free Software Foundation, too. I encourage you to do so.

local370voice's picture

Again

Since you choose to dodge the question you blow smoke and mirror diversion by insisting I need a Drupal history lesson. I thought you were warning me about personal insults. Since you are so versed in Drupal and the Association than how can I not assume you do not know exactly who Acquia is.
"Acquia is just one of hundreds, perhaps thousands, of companies that provide services around Drupal and contribute to the Drupal project." Actually how many of those hundreds,perhaps thousands own the Drupal Trademark as does Dries Buytaert Co-Founder and CTO of Acquia. How many of these many volunteers are paid in a number of ways and will be spending 70% of their paid Acquia time working with the Drupal Association?"However, the entire team at Acquia strongly believes that Dries must be able to effectively lead the Drupal project where the community wants it to go a portion of Dries’ time will be spent on activities associated with the Drupal project at large." "Dries Buytaert (Drupal project lead) teamed with Jay Batson to co-found Acquia."his job involves spending the bulk of his time on Drupal." So much for your unpaid volunteer speech. Business week:"Buytaert, who in 2001 came up with a new way for people to collaborate online and publish Web content. His idea turned into Drupal, a project that draws together software developers from around the world who collectively tinker with and add features to the content management system made available for free. Seven years on, as he tries to turn his idea into a successful business, Buytaert isn't taking any chances. He and fellow entrepreneur Jay Batson co-founded Acquia and have raised $7 million to help them in their quest to widen the use of Drupal."So tell us again how Acquia is just another company in the Drupal Community. By the way if you do not know these things than perhaps you need the history lesson in Drupal. But we know that is not true.

I am not saying not to use Drupal . As a mater of fact the more I see of it the more I like it. Great tool. If Acquia is correct in its mission to increase Drupal use 10 times of what it today I cannot imagine what is to come. I do not however it is fair to promote it as the "Future of Labor Communications" Remember. Buy Union. Work Union .Trade Union. And that includes Drupal,Acquia, Prometheus and Dansus. Do you as a ardent Union supporter feel that all these companies shuold be signatory to some Union if they are to make money pandering to Unions. As Union memebers should we not have a look at the companies and their investors connection to labor. If not I suggest you tell most of the Labor Unions in this country to cease their practices. When they go after the non Union to organize they know every detail right down to the Mexican Truckers Underwear size. We however should ignore that in the case of the Internet Technology industries. I don't feel you are a greedy business man as you stated. But I do feel that before you are a committed Union man your are a business man first.

Steve Dondley's picture

OK, if you don't think it's

OK, if you don't think it's fair to promote it as the "Future of Labor Communications," then don't. I have a different opinion so I will promote it as such.

If I am not pure enough for you or Drupal isn't either, use other services and other software. But I am done debating whether or not Acquia's involvement somehow taints Drupal. I feel like I'm arguing with someone who insists the world is flat or that evolution is bullshit. No amount of debate or scientific evidence will convince them otherwise. Your line of argument is that nonsensical, so it's not worth the time to really debate.

You also don't seem to stop and think that Drupal can easily be forked. Collectively, the labor movement could download the Drupal software and start building the own version and call it whatever they want. Nothing ties the code to Dries or Acquia. All they do is add features and functionality to the software. The trademark on the word "Drupal" is different from the code itself. Again, no one owns the code.

But if you feel so strongly about Drupal, you are free to go start a "whydrupalisbadforlabor.com" and convince the world otherwise. You seem to love picking out reasons why this guy or that thing sucks. Go for it.

And again, you are free to have your own opinion of me. Again, most people would disagree with you.

Steve Dondley's picture

I'm sorry if you feel insulted

Please point out where you feel slighted and I'll try to be more careful.

Steve Dondley's picture

Who said anything about unpaid volunteers?

There are volunteers and there are unpaid volunteers. Drupal is a mix of both. Acquia, as an organization, chooses to voluntarily contribute back the Drupal project by paying people to chip in. I have done the same. This is opposed to the alternative which is to build upon Drupal but not share your contributions.

Now, do you feel the need to shutdown your WordPress site because it was built with non-union programmers? Because I can assure you it was.

I have no ethical qualms about using free software. To me, free software epitomizes what unions stand for which is people working collectively to build a better society.

But if you do have questions about free software and how it is produced, then you should stop using it. But you are the only person I've ever met who has raised concerns about how ethical the development of free software is.

Steve Dondley's picture

This is just ridiculous

Get your last shots in because I'm closing this thread at 2:30pm. It's nonproductive.

Steve Dondley's picture

Flamewar deleted

I removed the flamewar.